April 11, 2008
[Stbx] F. [stbx],
You recently left on a trip to Hawaii (Saturday, April 5, 2008). I am pleased that you have had the opportunity to travel, hope that you enjoy your travel, and wish to offer my support and assistance for any future travel.
I have some concerns with how things were handled.
Those concerns:
We exercise joint custody of our children.
You were leaving [ourcity] for a two-week period. One of those weeks the children would have normally been with you and one of those weeks they would have spent with me.
1) You did not advise me that you were planning to leave, and that the children would be alone for a week, until the Wednesday prior to your departure (Saturday). This is inadequate notice and joint planning. In the future please advise me earlier of such instances.
You only mentioned that you were going on a trip during a telephone call I made to you with regard to arrangements I was making with you about [Son] and [Daughter] traveling with me to the U.S. to see Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton speak.
I am not asking for details of your travel plans or life activity, I am however, asking for reasonable advance notice of times when I may be required to provide additional support to and for our children – like a week in which you are not there as a in an emergency, to supervise, provide guidance, or drive them to lessons and such.
In no way should my comments be interpreted as admonishment on travel – far from it. I want you to travel. I want you to be able to do the things that you felt you were limited from doing while we were married.
You should just let me know a little earlier if I’m going to need to cover supervision or support activities. If I had chosen to go out of town in that period the kids would have been on their own. Even though [Son] is 16 years old, I am not comfortable with his ability to handle extraordinary situations without guidance. Chris, who is 18, and who lives at your house, is not, in my opinion, suitably mature or capable of appropriate supervision or emergency situation handling.
In our call (Wednesday) you raised a number of concerns you had. I needed to be elsewhere at the time of the call and did not have the time to discuss issues more fully. You should have called me earlier, or sent me a letter if you are uncomfortable with dealing with me in person or in conversation.
You talked to me about the fact that you were uncomfortable with leaving the children on their own for a week. That they had convinced you that they wanted to try being on their own. That you felt they would likely need extra supervision. That you were concerned that they might throw a party while you were away. That you wanted me to try to ensure there were no parties at the house. You gave me no definitional parameters to accompany any of your concerns or requests.
I have no problem with allowing the kids to try out spending time on their own as you and they advised me they wanted to do. There was inadequate time to discuss issues in that call on Wednesday night. We should have had a longer exchange of ideas on how to deal with that week the children would be on their own. In the future, please either call me or send me a letter/note.
2) You did not leave enough food in the house to, in my opinion, adequately cover meals and lunches during your week. You did not leave money to cover additional needs. This is inadequate.
I was very distressed to receive a call from the kids the afternoon of Tuesday, April 8, 2008 telling me they thought they might run out of food, and asking if they could have $30.00 to go buy more food. They told me that you had said you would leave $50.00 for them, but that it had not been left. After some thought I advised them to contact you for guidance. I told them that I would not leave them in the lurch for food, but that they needed to contact you, as it was your domicile and your week.
3) You did not leave them with contact numbers or contact information on how to reach you in Hawaii. This is improper and inadequate. Do not do this again. In the future leave proper contact information for the children on how to reach you when you are leaving them alone.
The children only had [brother-in-law]’s cell phone number as a contact. They tried calling the number 3 times and then left a message at my direction. As of Friday, April 11, 2008 that message had not been returned. Did you have any proof/information that [brother-in-law]’s cell phone would roam/track him to locations in Hawaii?
Leaving the children without adequate means to contact you is improper and inappropriate. You should have left a list of hotels and contact numbers.
In the future leave proper contact information for the children on how to reach you when you are leaving them alone, or explicitly advise me (and the children) that I have full custody and supervision for that week, like when we go on holidays. I am uncomfortable with the partial supervision and responsibility scenario. There should have been a full hand-off, and an explicit arrangement for the week.
Further to the food issue (this write-up is partially chronological/narrative):
I advised them to call their Grandmother as well. She advised them that she would bring them food if needed, but not any for Chris – as “he has his own money to buy his own food”. I concur with her on the matter of Chris’ food.
I went to the house to see how much food was left. I entered the house for a period of about 5 minutes to check the fridge, fridge freezer, lazy susan/corner cupboard, pantry cupboard, and downstairs freezer. The children did not invite me in, I told them I was coming in. I wanted to make sure that they were not just trying to score extra pizza and such from me.
I provided some food for [Son]’s lunches and gave instructions on how they should stretch the food available at the house.
4) You did not leave them with instructions on how to handle emergencies that may have arisen. If there were a plumbing or furnace problem what would have been their action set? There was no instruction set, or plumbers to call, or even instructions to call your mother to deal with any situation.
Their response was that they would call me. I am uncomfortable with this. While I still own half the house and would have dealt with any crisis, in the past you have explicitly advised me not to enter your house. You changed the locks.
I was uncomfortable with entering to check the food on this occasion, and felt uncomfortable with any other potential situation regarding the house. In the future please leave explicit instructions with the children, or with me on how such situations are to be handled.
Addendum:
You even left your car unlocked with CDs and the broken computer inside it. I gave the children instructions to lock the vehicle. I would have had them put the crook lock on it as well, but did not know where the key was for it to be sure that you could unlock the crook lock.
Future Handling:
I remain committed to the idea of joint custody, but in the future I expect better handling of such situations and of joint custody and management of the children and their interests. In this letter I have outlined my concerns and my feelings and desires about how some of these issues should dealt with.
To date I have tried to make my feelings and intent known through verbal contact. This is now a notice in writing. I look forward to working together in the future to address the best interests of our children.
[Cadbury]
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response
Thank you for your trust in me to allow me to view this. It is very comprehensive and the details thought out. I can only imagine your anger and frustration and possible numbness while writing this.
I have commented in blue - (very direct comments I should add). I know it probably reads choppy, but I have taken over an hour to read (close to 2 actually), to think about and respond. As always, I will not be offended if you disagree with my comments and I hope you will not take them defensively:
-----Original Message-----
From: [Cadbury]
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2008 12:00 PM
To: [Smitten]
Subject: your thoughts?
i am delivering this in a letter to the house, and sending it through my
lawyer to her lawyer
Your blog friends suggested that you do not engage her. By sending it to her house first, she will be engaged and will phone you directly – do you want this?
what have i missed?
(first draft)
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April 11, 2008
[stbx] F. [stbx],
Why the capital F.? And did she ever take your last name as a hyphen?
You recently left on a trip to Hawaii (Saturday, April 5, 2008). I am pleased that you have had the opportunity to travel, hope that you enjoy your travel, and wish to offer my support and assistance for any future travel.
I don't agree with the sugar sweet of "I am pleased that you have had the opportunity to travel, hope that you enjoy your travel". I understand why you write it, but in light of her horrifying behaviour, I suggest just the acknowledgement sentence of “I hope that you enjoyed your vacation, and wish to again offer accommodations for any child care responsibility in any future travel”. My wording sucks, but I hope you get what I mean. And also a sentence about how you would hope she would in turn extend the same accommodations in childcare arrangements for you.
I have some concerns with how things were handled.
Those concerns:
We exercise joint custody of our (the) children.
Given that you do not want to engage her nor personalize your current relationship, I would suggest to use “the” children instead of “our” – yes I know that it is improper and depersonalizes them, but in light of the relationship I would think it is okay.
You were leaving [ourcity] for a two-week period. One of those weeks the children would have normally been with you and one of those weeks they would have spent with me.
1) You did not advise me that you were planning to leave, and that the children would be alone for a week, until the Wednesday prior to your departure (Saturday). This is inadequate notice and joint planning. In the future please advise me earlier of such instances.
Suggest a specific time frame that you think is appropriate - 2 weeks or 1 month?
You only mentioned that you were going on a trip during a telephone call I made to you with regard to arrangements I was making with you about [Son] and [Daughter] traveling with me to the U.S. to see Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton speak.
I am not asking for details of your travel plans or life activity, I am however, asking for reasonable advance notice of times when I may be required to provide additional support to and for our (the)children – like a week in which you are not there as a in an emergency, to supervise, provide guidance, or drive them to lessons and such.
I would suggest again to use “the” children instead of “our”.
In no way should my comments be interpreted as admonishment on travel – far from it. I want you to travel. I want you to be able to do the things that you felt you were limited from doing while we were married.
First line is great – but the next lines give her power and a reason to bitch about and berate you for not meeting HER needs while you were married. She had opportunity to travel while she was with you – but it was her choice and behaviours that did not make it happen.
You should just let me know a little earlier if I’m going to need to cover supervision or support activities. Already been stated, and it sounds like you are pleading. There is no need to go into detail again. She is not a child (even though she acts like it) who has to have the message repeated in a softer way
If I had chosen to go out of town in that period the kids would have been on their own. Excellent comment and would be a good back up example of why you need advance notice of vacations
Even though [Son] is 16 years old, I am not comfortable with his ability to handle extraordinary (emergency) situations without guidance.
Yes
Chris, who is 18, and who lives at your house, is not, in my opinion, suitably mature or capable of appropriate supervision or emergency situation handling.
Yes, but restate that he is only a tenant and not an adult in charge (as well as your other well stated statements of him). In fact I would really hope that she did not even think of him as someone who could handle any emergencies - the fact that he is living there is irrelevant to any childcare arrangements she should have made. Appropriate arrangements would be to have grama and grandpa come over every second day and check in.
In our call (Wednesday) you raised a number of concerns you had. I needed to be elsewhere at the time of the call and did not have the time to discuss issues more fully.
Another good example of why you need to know of her vacation time in advance
You should have called me earlier, or sent me a letter if you are uncomfortable with dealing with me in person or in conversation.
This is giving her ammunition – this letter is not about whether she feels comfortable around you or not. It is about childcare responsibilities. Acknowledging her ‘fraidy cat’ game and manipulation will give her power and deflects from the immediate issue. Do not stray. Also – are you just guessing that she did not want to see you in person or did she say it? This also ties in with her need to suck you in by talking about her worries about the kids.
I would suggest that you really decide how you are going to deal with her – are you going to just correspond through writing or through the lawyer or are you going to continue to verbally talk with her? Because the inconsistencies of what you have told me that you want to do (only communicate through paper) versus what you are actually doing (talking with her on the phone and in person) seem to me to be causing some problems and stress for you. She is using that inconsistency to her advantage (eg: being a fraidy cat in your presence).
You talked to me about the fact that you were uncomfortable with leaving the children on their own for a week. That they had convinced you that they wanted to try being on their own. That you felt they would likely need extra supervision. That you were concerned that they might throw a party while you were away. That you wanted me to try to ensure there were no parties at the house. You gave me no definitional parameters to accompany any of your concerns or requests.
Defending her house and property are not your responsibility. Well, I guess partially as it is still your house. But in reference to my above comment, what role do you want to play in her life? The issue at hand is child care, not house care.
I can guarantee that if the situation was reversed and you were concerned about a house party that would either have supervision from your family or would just not go on the trip.
I have no problem with allowing the kids to try out spending time on their own as you and they advised me they wanted to do. There was inadequate time to discuss issues in that call on Wednesday night. We should have had a longer exchange of ideas on how to deal with that week the children would be on their own. In the future, please either call me or send me a letter/note.
Already been stated. And by saying that “We should have had a longer exchange of ideas on how to deal with” I read it as you are inviting her to have LONG conversations with you and that you really WANT to speak with her. (I understand that if indeed a conversation about childcare happened between you two that you would stick to the topic and would only speak about relevant topics – but she will take the opportunity to wander just to continue conversation with you. Do you want this?
2) You did not leave enough food in the house to, in my opinion, adequately cover meals and lunches during your week. You did not leave money to cover additional needs. This is inadequate.
I was very distressed to receive a call from the kids the afternoon of Tuesday, April 8, 2008 telling me they thought they might run out of food, and asking if they could have $30.00 to go buy more food. They told me that you had said you would leave $50.00 for them, but that it had not been left. After some thought I advised them to contact you for guidance. I told them that I would not leave them in the lurch for food, but that they needed to contact you, as it was your domicile and your week.
In this section, add the paragraph about you entering the house, and of [Son]’s lunches. Oh and could you give a quote from them that gives you justifiable cause about their starvation as a reason to enter her house?. Especially any quote that would make her look bad and caused for immediate parental reaction from you.
3) You did not leave them with contact numbers or contact information on how to reach you in Hawaii. This is improper and inadequate. Do not do this again. In the future leave proper contact information for the children on how to reach you when you are leaving them alone.
The children only had [brother-in-law]’s cell phone number as a contact. They tried calling the number 3 times and then left a message at my direction. As of Friday, April 11, 2008 that message had not been returned. Did you have any proof/information that [brother-in-law]’s cell phone would roam/track him to locations in Hawaii?
Leaving the children without adequate means to contact you is improper and inappropriate. You should have left a list of hotels and contact numbers.
In the future leave proper contact information for the children on how to reach you when you are leaving them alone, or explicitly advise me (and the children) that I have full custody and supervision for that week, like when we go on holidays.
Who is “we”?
I am uncomfortable with the partial supervision and responsibility scenario. Did you tell her this initially?
There should have been a full hand-off (elaborate a bit on what you mean by hand off), and an explicit arrangement for the week.
Yes.
Further to the food issue (this write-up is partially chronological/narrative):
I advised them to call their Grandmother as well. She advised them that she would bring them food if needed,
if needed? I thought she actually brought stuff. Anyways, talk about that you felt comfortable with this arrangement and did not think that you had to further intervene. Maybe also that the kids were so concerned that they phoned your mom?
but not any for Chris – as “he has his own money to buy his own food”. I concur with her on the matter of Chris’ food.
I went to the house to see how much food was left. I entered the house for a period of about 5 minutes to check the fridge, fridge freezer, lazy susan/corner cupboard, pantry cupboard, and downstairs freezer. The children did not invite me in,
Almost sounds like you barged in – can you soften this? Also to give you back up, state that the children accompanied you through the house.
I told them I was coming in. I wanted to make sure that they were not just trying to score extra pizza and such from me. yes
I provided some food for [Son]’s lunches and gave instructions on how they should stretch the food available at the house.
4) You did not leave them with instructions on how to handle emergencies that may have arisen. If there were a plumbing or furnace problem what would have been their action set? There was no instruction set, or plumbers to call, or even instructions to call your mother to deal with any situation.
Their response was that they would call me. I am uncomfortable with this. While I still own half the house and would have dealt with any crisis, in the past you have explicitly advised me not to enter your house. You changed the locks.
This statement could be a potential conflict with you making the decision to enter the house anyways. Can it be taken out or reworded? Is it necessary?
I was uncomfortable with entering (your house) to check the food on this occasion, and felt uncomfortable with any other potential situation regarding the house. Maybe this is a good place to add in a quote from the kids as to their desperation and that there was no one else for them to contact? In the future please leave explicit instructions with the children, or with me on how such situations are to be handled. I know this is just a draft, but the sentence sounds like it is giving her future permission to NOT leave them well prepared when she leaves. In a few paragraphs above you have listed some expectations for her. In fact, an actual detailed list might be a good idea to include. One that you will also adhere to when you go on vacation.
Also, to reiterate, what role do you want to play in her life.
Addendum:
You even left your car unlocked with CDs and the broken computer inside it. I gave the children instructions to lock the vehicle. I would have had them put the crook lock on it as well, but did not know where the key was for it to be sure that you could unlock the crook lock.
I can read your frustration in this sentence. Remember that her stuff is NOT your problem. She is NOT your responsibility. If her stuff gets trashed it is her fault.
And, even though this is a draft, it almost sounds like you were snooping. Either omit or say that [Daughter] noticed it. Think about the goal of the letter.
Future Handling:
I remain committed to the idea of joint custody,
Do you really? Only say this if you truly feel it. Otherwise say some concerns about continuing with joint in light of her increasingly bizarre and inappropriate behaviours.
but in the future I expect better handling of such situations and of joint custody and management of the children and their interests. In this letter I have outlined my concerns and my feelings and desires about how some of these issues should dealt with.
To date I have tried (there is no such thing as try. You did). to make my feelings and intent known through verbal contact. you have also expressed in writing (eg the suicide warning letter). This is now a notice in writing. Perhaps say that this is the second letter of inappropriate parenting behaviours. I look forward to working together in the future to address the best interests of our children this sounds too friendly – reflect your feelings of outrage and annoyance and disappointment –or whatever. Write about expectations of behaviour.
[Cadbury]
5 comments:
Wow! That is a doozy of a letter. I wholeheartedly agree with all of Smitten's critiques. She is spot on in making this letter seem less emotional, which is what STBX seems to thrive on.
I have to say, I'm really a little put off than anyone would allow two children, even if one's age is 16, to live on their own for a week with no emergency contacts or supervision. My kids are the same age (roughly) as yours and I would never in a million years dream of allowing them to stay home alone for a week. There are too many things that could happen. I know that you went along with this because STBX thought it was ok.
There is a reason that we are not considered adults until we are 18. I know that your son is considered mature, but really, he is still just a child.
This of course, is just my two cents, for what it's worth.
I agree with Jenn: doozy of a letter. I also agree with her opinion of Smitten's critiques. Take her advice in revising your letter.
I also agree with Jenn with regards to leaving the children on their own. I considered myself to be a fairly liberal parent when my girls were teenagers, but even I wouldn't have left them alone for a week. Too many things could happen.
....and like Jenn....this is only my two cents...for what it's worth.
This is a subject that hits me close to home. My ex left our son home alone when he was 14. Ex went to Europe, leaving son at home in NJ for over a week. I didn't know, I was living in Mex. The rest of the family were living in Ca. There wasn't anyone in the entire state of NJ there to help my boy. When I found out it was after the fact and I made the mistake of NOT calling child protective services because I confronted EX and didn't want my son to be angry(er) with me. If only I knew then what I know now.
The confrontation only made EX laugh at me, and my son angry that I didn't feel he was mature enough to bachelor it alone. The only thing that made a difference was telling EX's family what he did.
My anger fueled EX's need to get to me, BUT his family's disapproval hit him close to home. He never left our son alone again.
I understand your anger and frustration. My heart is beating in my throat as I read and now as I type. I can only caution you to not feed into your STBX's needs, stick to your points as Smitten has suggested and be brief and to the point.
Just my 2 pesos too!
w.
Mr. C. . . . I would not have given it to her. . . . I would have documented it with the lawyer. . . . I would have posted it here to air it out. . . . I think she lives for any attention you will give her. . . .
I know this is critical, but you could have said HELL NO to them staying by themselves. . . . you played into her manipulative schemes. They are your kids. .. . get them away from the Crazy Biatch . . . . then there will be no dealing with her at all. They are the connection. . . . she failed the test. . . just stop them from being around her.
Ciao
In light of the fact that others have given solid, calming feedback, I will merely say:
I simply CANNOT believe that I didn't hear about a murder of a certain Canadian in Hawaii.
NO ONE leaves children alone unless that ONE is FUCKING CERTIFIABLE.
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